100: Blending Tech & Teaching: Tia Samuel's Transition from K-12 to Senior Program Manager at Intellum & the Evolution of Learning

Holly Owens (00:02):

Hello everyone, and welcome to another fantastic episode of Edup Ed Tech. My name is Holly Owens and I'm your host. And today we have a fabulous guest with us. We have Tia Samuel, she's a senior product, excuse me, senior program manager in education at Intel. Tia, welcome to the show.

Tia Samuel (00:28):

Thank you. Thank you. I'm very excited to be here today.

Holly Owens (00:31):

Yes, we are looking to get into all the wonderful details about yourself and tellem and the wonderful things you're doing in this space. But first we want to know about you. Tell us about your journey. How did you make it here to become senior program manager in education at In Tellum?

Tia Samuel (00:49):

My pleasure. Actually, I came through K 12 education, so I was a teacher and I was a trainer, training other teachers. And then I actually founded a private school based in Atlanta. It's now virtual, still open K 12 school. I wrote the curriculum for it and I have my master of science degree in education psychology. So I'm obsessed with the way people learn throughout their life cycle. And then my e d D is in curriculum development and that's all but dissertation. So crush your fingers. Wish me luck. You might want to also, I'm the same.

Holly Owens (01:24):

That's the hardest part, isn't it?

Tia Samuel (01:26):

Oh my gosh. I wrote like 80 pages and then I became uninspired, and so I'm like, oh my gosh. Sure.

Holly Owens (01:35):

I totally get it. I can totally empathize with you there. We're going to have to do a podcast about that portion of our Sign me up, Sign

Tia Samuel (01:44):

Me up. I can speak about it all day. So I would say the traditional course that took me into curriculum development, project management, program management, and then I was training in a school. I started doing some freelance work for different organizations and I went into id, so I was an instructional designer, and then as that field kind of ebbed and flowed, I became an learning experience designer. And then I came over to and Tell, and I was actually a content curator for a program we were launching called cat kat.com to improve the way people worked actually and help people get better at work. It's still up. You ever just want to go and learn something new about management or one of those kinds of skills. It's still up and running. And I went from curation and I kind of bounced around the company throughout the learning departments, and I settled into the education department and now I'm a senior program manager and I absolutely love it. But yeah, I came through K 12 education. I'm also a professor, so I assist teachers coming in and learning how to adapt their curriculum in this new world, especially for adult learners.

Holly Owens (02:56):

I love your path. We have very similar paths. I also still teach in higher education. I teach instructional design courses, but you've done the gambit. You've been a K through 12 teacher, you've done some content curation, instructional design work, L X D program management, absolutely love your path, and I'm sure you have tons to share with people about all the different avenues you've taken. I love this question to start out with because not everybody's path is linear. We are often under the misconception that it's going to be, okay, I'm going to do this for five years and I'm going to do this for two years and I'm going to do this, is not like that.

Tia Samuel (03:37):

Agreed. And when I'm speaking to other young people and they're like, well, how did you get there? And I tell them, be an open to opportunity. I get bored really easily, hence my a b D path right now. I'm bored and I'm like, what am I doing here? I have this existential crisis every two to five years, which is a long gap. Sometimes it's two years I had my son, so it became five years where I just kind of do an audit to see if what I'm doing is still, am I being challenged in it and am I challenging the field, the industry? Am I contributing in any way? And the reason I've been able to sustain so long at Intel is because I'm also running my passion projects alongside what I do for work. And that just keeps me going. So I haven't been bored in years now.

(04:25):

I absolutely love what I do, but yeah, you just kind of stay open opportunity. And when they say, Hey, would you like to do this? If you would, you say yes. And I think I can do well at it. Tellem also gives us a stipend of 3,500 a year to grow and develop ourselves. Oh, That's nice. Very, very nice. Very, it's called the Boost Budget, and as for us to boost ourselves within our career field, personal or professional, and I've done everything. I just got back from a conference in London just about every year I go to a conference out the country. There was one in Qatar, two in Ghana, one in London. So I kind of travel the world and go to these conferences. So I get inspired by listening to other people. Just like what you're doing right now with this podcast.

Holly Owens (05:12):

Yes. I definitely, you're inspiring me already. We're not even five minutes into the episode and I'm just writing down all the notes and looking at the website. I like you. I like to prepare a little bit, but I also like to have that authentic reaction, it sounds like. And tell Tellem has some good things going On there. Yes, yes,

Tia Samuel (05:31):

Very much so. Tell em has some really good things going on. They have good people powering you. Yeah, it sounds like a great culture already. But before we jump right into that, I want to make sure that we, is there anybody you want to shout out or who has inspired you along this journey that you just like, oh, this person or this teacher, or just anybody you want to shout out

Holly Owens (05:51):

Along the way, who has supported you to where you're at now?

Tia Samuel (05:54):

Yes. I have a couple of people, actually. One, Arlita Livingston, my big sister. She kind of started me on my path towards education, and it has been, I'm forever changed because of that. Another one in Tellem. I came in under Dr. Julia Rik, and that's who I was doing content curation under. And I am completely inspired by her journey and her promotion of me and the way she pushed me forward at the company. She really, really had my best interest at heart. And that feels good when you work for a corporate company and you feel like your leader has your best interest at heart. Following her was Vicki Kennedy, and then following Vicki, it is now Christopher Baker. And I really want to shout him out because I walk alongside him as a leader on the team, and he's also my leader on the team. But our coaching and just development in the ed tech space has been very next level, very next level. So I just want to shout those four people out. Aletha Livingston, Dr. Julie Hooper, Vicki Kennedy, and now Chris, thank you for giving. Awesome,

Holly Owens (07:02):

Awesome. And I'm so glad to hear that you've had that support and for growth. I think that sometimes that's missing at some corporations and that really causes employer retaining issues, that kind of stuff. But it sounds like you've had a wonderful support system around you the whole entire time.

Tia Samuel (07:19):

Yes, a hundred percent. Yeah. I think that would be the one thing I would say about my tenure at in Tellum, the company's doing awesome things, but beyond that, the people and the humans at the company have been really vested in my development and growth on a human level. And so I'm also vested in them because of that. So yeah, I definitely want to champion that.

Holly Owens (07:41):

Absolutely. So you've been in this space for a while and you've jumped around to a few different positions and had experience. Do you have a definition, have you come to find your own personal definition of what Ed tech is in this space through being an instructional designer, a program manager, a teacher? I know it all looks different in those types of roles, but do you have one you could share? What does that look like? What is ed tech?

Tia Samuel (08:09):

Ooh, that's a good question. I know, I know it's a loaded question, but it's also like it wants to get into,

Holly Owens (08:20):

If you go into different organizations and companies, you see how instructional design and an instructional designer's roles and responsibilities differ from place to place.

Tia Samuel (08:31):

So I would say, I don't have my own definition, but I love the challenge. I will be creative on that.

Holly Owens (08:38):

I knew you could do it. I know, I know.

Tia Samuel (08:41):

If I was to piece it together, I would say it's the use of technology, and that's from a hardware and a software perspective, learning principles, science of learning, facilitation, that's all kind of within the same realm. And then the application of that. So the biggest, I won't say issue or challenge, but I'll say the biggest goal of anything within the realm of ed tech is actually for learning to happen. So however you're transmitting that knowledge using technology as a vehicle, at the end of the day, learning should happen with the end user. So that'll probably be my definition.

Holly Owens (09:27):

That's great. I love you incorporated all the sciences and the theories and everything, and then the part about the application of it, because we can talk about it all that we want, but the application piece is so important for the learning to happen. I love that definition. Great,

Tia Samuel (09:43):

Thanks.

Holly Owens (09:46):

Well, let's get into it, Tia. Let's talk a little bit about and tell 'em, and let's talk a little bit about what you do there. What products or services do you offer and how do you help institutions and organizations in education?

Tia Samuel (09:58):

So we support and help different organizations educate their customers, partners, employees on the products and services that they sell. We're actually a platform, a learning platform. So some people are familiar with the term L M s, if you're more familiar with that term. That's the easiest way to explain it, but it's so much more than that. It's very robust. So we have the platform and then we also have a methodology. So it's like the coupling of the two. It's giving you the vehicle to disseminate this information, and it's also giving you a methodology of how to match business goals with the outcomes, your intended outcomes and the needs of your learners. So that's what we do at Intel 'em, it's simply stated, but it's a whole lot of work on the backend.

Holly Owens (10:41):

I can only imagine how much it takes to, I know what it's like on the L M SS side from being in admin stuff. I can only imagine what it's bringing that methodology piece into it and also aligning it with the goals.

Tia Samuel (10:57):

That's really the magic sauce. I will say that's the difference. The differentiator at Intel is our methodology. We also have a content authoring tool, and it's named Evolve. It is literally one of the best on the market that I have used as a designer, and that many designers have said, Evolv actually is another vehicle that we use to help people meet those needs and their business objectives. But I don't want to make it seem like it's just focused on their business objectives and outcomes. But it is important to make sure that your learning is connected to a business outcome. So at the end when you're doing a measurement and your assessment and you want to know, did we achieve the intended result? It's twofold, right? It's did the learner learn? And then what is the benefit to the company and the learner from whatever it is they learned? So in tell's kind of like the full package, it's the software and then it's also the coupling with the learning science alongside it.

Holly Owens (11:47):

Yeah, it sounds like you all have it figured out, and I love that, that you have a content authoring tool built right into everything, because I think that makes it so much easier for the end user, especially if you're from instructional design world and this the L X D world, or you're just a content creator having to go different spots for different things and then learn this tool, the piece together with this tool and trying to put all the, oh, my old lady brain gets tired of that. I like the all in one. I like the all in one. It's true. It's

Tia Samuel (12:21):

True. And Holly, to your point, I know you were joking when you say your old lady brain gets tired of it, Even Off putting, right, it becomes like ageist in a way because you know how many people, especially once you get to a certain level of development within your career that you want to use eight different platforms and tools and learn all the thing, your stack just becomes a little bit too stacked. So the simplicity of it all that I can have all of this integrated into one, that's really the sell, it kind of sells itself. It's a way to engage, educate your audiences, and you can create the content, put it in the platform, and then you can manage it and you can do that at scale. That's not easy. Easily implemented by all platforms. And I've used at least three to six, and I say three to six because some of them, like Blackboard, they were in the K 12 or higher learning space, right?

Holly Owens (13:12):

And

Tia Samuel (13:12):

Then when I'm thinking ed tech more in corporate learning, those were very different than what I was using over there. But still rarely could I do everything in one place. And then you start having conversations about learning science and how the application and facilitation, and that takes it to a whole nother level. So that's why champion the product in the company.

Holly Owens (13:38):

Yeah, absolutely. So as much insight as you can give us, what does a senior program manager do at Intel? So what are some of the projects and things that you've been working on that you're excited about? Anything that you can share with us?

Tia Samuel (13:52):

Yes, yes, yes. Right now, large project that's on my roadmap is certification programs. So we're looking to build out a certification process for our evolve authoring tool so that IDs and LDS that are using it, that they can actually be certified in it and that can help 'em in the way that they charge for it, or even build different content out for different companies, freelance, as well as even help companies who want to empower their admin to just build better content for their audiences. So that's huge on the roadmap right now, those certification programs and then a platform certification program to say, I am certified at this level within the platform, and that can inform their work within their current job or if they're looking for another job, it can really be something they can socialize on LinkedIn. So that's really exciting because you get to build that, we get to build the curriculum, all the assessments, the measurement, we get to put our methodology into practice.

(14:49):

So I'm most excited about, and to the other part of your question, what does a senior program manager do? I actually work along the other 2:00 PM. So the way we're set up on our education team, one of our program managers, they kind of do all things platform related, and that's the Intel platform, what you would know as the L M S, the actual software. And then the other side of it, she does all things evolve. So she does our content authoring tool, and then we have lxd that support those initiatives. And we have a program platform administrator, and then we have a director, and then we kind of spin from the middle in that kind of way. So I help keep all the moving pieces together. For the most part, I work in Asana doing project management. So anything that we need to work with a stakeholder for our SMEs, I keep all of that together in Asana to make sure we're delivering what we should deliver, creating it for our internal audiences as well as for our clients.

(15:45):

So if our clients say, we need more training on this, and we may get notification from support that they are searching for one particular aspect of our platform a lot. And that will also ding to us, we need to create some training alongside this. And then we go through the process, what's the business goal of creating this training? What's the intended outcome? And we just go through our own methodology and then at the end we create the learning content and then we deliver it. So I manage end to end That entire. Oh my goodness. It sounds like a fun role though. Now I can see why you're not getting bored.

Holly Owens (16:17):

There's a lot to do. There's a lot of movie pieces.

Tia Samuel (16:20):

A lot of movie pieces. Exactly.

Holly Owens (16:23):

And I'd imagine that all of your experience teaching ID L X D that has all prepared you to be in this particular role.

Tia Samuel (16:32):

A hundred percent. A hundred percent. I would say that my experience that most prepared me for this role would be K 12 teaching, ironically, not even the adult teaching, because in K 12, you have to prove that that child knows the thing. You can't just kind of do open up your brain and dump everything in and then say, okay, I taught the child and send 'em out the door. They want some kind of assessment, typically standardize. They want to know benchmarks. Can you show me success here before we get there? So it's a lot of pressure in the K 12 world, I would say way more pressure than it is when you get to the adult learning world, because adult learners, you kind of put the impetus on them. If you need to learn, you should learn, go home and study, you learn. But as a child, you really put it on the teacher.

(17:22):

It's my job to make sure you get what it is that I'm intending to hand you. And so that's how I use all of that in my job now. I'm like, okay, if our learners did not learn based on surveys, assessment, personal feedback, what can we do different? And iterate, iterate, iterate. I would say those probably my Absolutely. You Put it out there and then you get the feedback and then you immediately iterate on it and put else out there. That's even better. So now, one of our PMs, they're working on this particular, I would say, stack of learning content, and he just found something I created years ago on the backend, and he was like, oh my God, Tia, I just found this and I cracked a blast. And I was like, yeah, but what you created is way better than what I created years ago.

Holly Owens (18:09):

But you started it. You started the situation.

Tia Samuel (18:13):

Yes, yes. And so to see where it's come is so beautiful. I didn't, it's developed to a place where I wouldn't have even thought it could have, but one, our technology developed, our product developed, so all things developed. And then AI really, really kind of adding that to the fold that has changed the way we work. Yeah, I

Holly Owens (18:33):

Was going to say, I can't imagine, I was trying not to get too much off topic because you're really intriguing me with a lot of these things that you're talking about in your role in that and tell 'em, and I love how you all are set up, what you're doing, how you professionally develop, how you just get pinged about like, well, this needs to change and it can change, and it's fine. It's

Tia Samuel (18:58):

Not always the final iteration. And I stress that so much to my students, especially when they're making their first

Holly Owens (19:05):

Online training course ever. I'm like, your first iteration is not always your best iteration. It's going to go through multiple, multiple, multiple evolutions. It's

Tia Samuel (19:15):

True. It's true. And the thing that I love specifically about this company is that there's a blending of both. It's the learning science and then it's the business goal. And so the learning science almost anchors that business goal and objective, and that allows me to bring all of my education, all of my background, all of who I am every day to work, and then appreciate what everyone else is bringing to it as well. I think if you're, I would say addicted to theory as I am, which I'm addicted to theory. I love it. I love studying the way people learn and watching examples and research and studies about, they thought people learn in this way, but they found out a circular, actually, you should go back. So let me give you an example to bring this all. Typically back in the day, I'll say ancient methodology of learning is you assess at the end, right?

(20:10):

Well, that was debunked. And they said, no, you have to do assessments throughout. You have to do these knowledge checks throughout the learning. It reinforces the learning, and it also allows the learner to see, oh, I'm actually getting it right. And then at the end, you may do kind of a roundup, but actually that assessment throughout is more meaningful. That's a huge change. Huge change to K 12 and adult learning. I mean, it's just a big deal. So coupling the learning science and then the product develops to accommodate that. Being a part of that, it's like being a part of a movement. It is really exciting for me. Yeah,

Holly Owens (20:46):

It's a for sure. And because some people are still stuck in that ancient way and don't realize that they're doing a disservice to their learners and their participants who are there for a reason. They have goals, and it's not about, oh, take this test and regurgitate it at the end. Exactly. Regurgitate the information. Oh, so archaic. So archaic.

Tia Samuel (21:10):

Exactly. I said ancient, but archaic is a nice, Yeah,

Holly Owens (21:14):

Same thing, same difference. Honestly,

Tia Samuel (21:18):

Definitely archaic. So those kinds of things to be at the forefront of that movement, that is exciting for me. Working in the background now, I was much more in the foreground. I didn't mention this, I forgot. I was also over onboarding. So I onboarded hundreds of employees during a time where in tele experienced large growth, I was creating the onboarding content. So I was kind of internally facing for a long time and the face of the company as people were hired. So I've now moved to the background a little bit more as a senior pm. So I would say if you don't like the background, it probably isn't for you. I'm more so working with stakeholders at the company, my director and my PMs to execute. But I love it because I feel like I'm a part of the engine. So you absolutely love it Back then, and

Holly Owens (22:05):

I know that people who are listening to this and hearing your story of where you've been and where you are now, especially transitioning teachers are people who are in the ID industry and looking to level up. They're like, this is possible. You can do this.

Tia Samuel (22:19):

Oh, absolutely. That's why I started with Dr. Julia Hooper. She saw my resume and funny story, she told me the chat box actually threw it away when she was going through the resume. Of Course they did. Of course they did, right?

Holly Owens (22:32):

Of course They did. I used to work in China, and so they wanted someone that lived in Atlanta, and

Tia Samuel (22:37):

They saw China on the resume and threw it away how they were taught to scan. She pulled it out, the trash can read through it, and from my background, found it intriguing enough to bring me in for an interview. I have to champion her. Because to do that, you really have to be vested in the program and the people that it takes to power that program. But I thought that story always, it inspires me to keep going whenever I get burnt out, which I would like to say is rare because my job changes so much in terms of the execution of it. So last week, my primal focus was on something else, and this week I'm like, okay, we're about to launch the certification. We need to do a launch. We are about to launch this. This is coming out, the product is changing in this way.

(23:22):

We need to do a content audit week to week based on the different shifts in the industry and our company. It changes what the focus is. It used to be internal. Now it's external. Let's make sure our clients and partners are trained and know how to use our product. We're in the customer education field, so we have to lean in using our methodology. We like to say on our E D U team that we're the gold standard. We want to do all the things that we're telling our clients to do. So it's inspiring and empowering at the same time. Yes.

Holly Owens (23:52):

Oh my gosh. I love it. I love it. I had to flip my page earlier. You probably heard it in the podcast. I was taking notes. I forget that my mic's still on and I'm flipping the page, but I always take notes and just write down some of the stuff that inspires me and things to put into the show notes. So I know we talked about your certification programs and your platform certification. Is there anything else that's on the roadmap for the upcoming year that you can share with the audience that they should be getting excited about with Intel em, besides all the wonderful things you've already shared?

Tia Samuel (24:25):

Yes, yes, yes. We're about to also create more industry related content. So not just product education, but to explain how customers can grow in their role. And we're really excited about that. So we've been building that on the backend, and we're going launch that probably by the end of the year, top of next year. And that's going to be huge. Just more foundational information on how any platform you're using, of course we would like you to use ours, but with any platform you use, how can you do better and be better at it? So we'll be coming out with a lot of that, of course, more along the lines of learning science and those certification programs. Those are probably the biggest things on our roadmap coming out. And then our product is just continuing to develop and the use of ai, the integration of that, we're looking at that as well now.

Holly Owens (25:12):

Oh, I can't wait to see what that does.

Tia Samuel (25:15):

No, I know. I'm

Holly Owens (25:16):

Excited. I'm excited. Oh my goodness. You and I could probably talk for at least another hour because I have so many questions I want to ask you, but I want to leave it open for you to come back for where are they now episode, and to wrap it up, I have two final questions for you. Really like three. I want to know is there anything that we missed, anything else that you'd like to share? And then I definitely want to get your take. What does the future of education look like? So anything that we missed, and then tell us about the future.

Tia Samuel (25:49):

Okay, let me start with the future.

(25:50):

I'm aist. That Sounds good. I'm Aist, so I love that. I would say, okay, this is funny. This is actually my doctorate. So it's funny you ask. I think that our entire education system is archaic, and that's K from kindergarten all through the lifecycle because it's still a, I don't want to use this model, I don't want to get too far out into theory, but they call it the banking model where it's like you make these deposits, and I just don't think that that's a sustainable model for this changing world. People don't need you to make deposits. Realistically. People could just go on Google and YouTube, YouTube University, TikTok University and learn a lot of what they want to learn. So I think what's going to change in education in the future is actually human interaction. Ironically, I think there's the human element because a lot of the baseline things you can learn on the computer that you don't really need a teacher to teach you that for nine months in a year.

(26:47):

I don't think the kids need it. I think they're bored, rightfully so. I think adult learners are bored. Our attention spans move like this because our world has shifted. Our world moves that fast. And so in a world that's speeding up, education to me is still too slow. It's not ahead of us. We're walking alongside it. I'm like, yeah, that makes sense, but tell me something I didn't know. You know what I mean? Exactly. I'm, I'm not wowed by it. I'm not really learning. So in terms of learning, that goes back to don't hit me like apprenticeships, working underneath another person watching paying attention. There's something in the experience of learning that is where it actually happens and occurs. So that's what I champion. I think the future of learning, we're actually going to give up the baseline items that you don't need a teacher or a facilitator to coordinate for you. You could figure that out on your own. You could do self-paced learning, but the more complex things that you like this, this podcast, no, this conversation is authentically happening real time. There's no way you can search this on Google and get it until I say it. You know what I mean? Until you ask the

(27:57):

Question based on what I just said. So for dynamic learning, that only happens with human interaction. So that's what I think the future of learning is.

Holly Owens (28:04):

Oh, I'm so glad you said that. I'm so glad because I think there's a lot of fear with AI and stuff going around that the humans are going to be replaced and this is happening. And we've all watched too many movies or we watched

Tia Samuel (28:15):

Too many Too.

Holly Owens (28:17):

Irobot with Will Smith way far too many times to think that things like that are going to happen. And I'm on the same page with you. I think it's only going to enhance what we do. And as humans, we're going to have the creative freedom to figure out other ways of doing things and sit with ourselves and process, I can't wait. Honestly, I can't wait I to happen now.

Tia Samuel (28:40):

Same with me. I'm like, come on, let's go. Let's go. Just like Covid came. No one knew that was coming and they sent everyone home and then something beautiful happened, right? Remote work became a thing. And fun fact, at Intelli, I always worked remotely before. We're an international company, so most of us were based all over the world. Although we're an Atlanta based company, that's something I was already doing that wasn't new to me, but I saw people really transform when they were able to work from home. They were able to be more present with their families, whether that was a good or a bad thing, and they were able to do different things and work, and they were like, wow. And it really transformed the way we work. I think we're about to go through another transformation. I'm hoping it doesn't have to be connected to the same thing.

(29:23):

The last one was, and I think transformation is good. Change is always good, in my opinion. It can be uncomfortable, but it's good. So we can give up the things that we can all, I'm like, you can learn that my son doesn't actually have to go to school to learn two plus two. He could pick that up from home. He could learn that on one of these zillions of programs on his iPad or life will teach it to him. I want him to go to school for the interaction with the other students to learn those intangibles. I want him to go to school because there's something in the laughter of the teacher and trying to give an example for the two plus two that he actually gets from it. So that kind of education I think is going to become more central to the way we learn. And I think it's going to change the way we do ed tech, corporate education and everything, all of it.

Holly Owens (30:13):

I agree with you and oh my goodness, Tia, I could talk to you for, I feel like we're old friends, and I'm so much on the same wavelength with you with all this because I love it being an instructional designer for such a long period of time and doing all the things on the backend, which I really enjoy and I enjoy doing some of the things that you do as a program manager or senior program manager, just like it's amazing what the possibilities are. And you said that you were already working from home. You're like, this isn't new to me. And people were freaking out and then now people are like, oh no. Now we're going hybrid. And people have to come back to the office. And I love that the aspect of the human interaction. I love being with my team, but also I think about if I had to go back in an office maybe a couple days a week, what would that be like? How would that impact what I've done for the past three, four years sitting at home? And I know education surrounds all that. So we have to prepare our learners for what's coming and what type of work environment they're going to be in

Tia Samuel (31:21):

And let them know. What I always recommend to my son is you have to be able to self monitor. That's why I like blended educational approaches. So sometimes you can do content that you can manage yourself. I like that you can sometimes opt out of content. You can test out of it and say, I already know this information. Or if you need to learn it, it can be right on time learning. You can watch a video, you can go to a live session. To me, that's the future of education. It's a blended learning approach. It's not a one size fits all. It's how do I need this particular lesson to be given to me? If it's math, I need complete silence. If I'm reading a book, I need complete silence. But if it's science or social studies, I actually like noise. It depends. You know what I mean?

(32:06):

It's not like there's one way that all children learn all things. There's not one way. All adults learn all things. So in the field of ed tech, in the realm of corporate education, you just have to consider what's the best way I can present this information in all ways so that however that person wants to take it in, they can take it in. They also debunk the myth of people having different learning modalities. And I used to be married to that one. That was my whole everything. That was your Whole world as an educator. Whole world differentiation,

Holly Owens (32:37):

Classroom Management.

Tia Samuel (32:39):

Yeah, well, this child learns this way and this child learns that way. And then they were like, actually, we all learn always at different times. And that actually resonates more with me. That makes more sense to me. So if you have a learning platform, how do you deliver that? How do you deliver always. It's interesting, but I think that's the future of education.

Holly Owens (32:57):

Absolutely. And I love the challenge. Love to see what we can do in this space. Well, Tia, I can't thank you enough for coming on and talking about all these things with me and sharing all the wonderful things that you're doing with inte your path and just all this great advice that you probably unknowingly give to people who are transitioning roles, which is amazing. So thank you so much for coming on and sharing your experiences. Thank

Tia Samuel (33:27):

You for having me. I'm really excited about coming back again to talk about the, where are they? Oh yeah. Six to 12

Holly Owens (33:32):

Months. We like to reach back out and do a Where are they now? Episode, because we know things change, like you said, and evolve over time. We want to know what you're doing, what's happening, what worked, what didn't work. We need the full update.

Tia Samuel (33:45):

I can't wait. I'll see you soon.

Holly Owens (33:48):

Sounds good.